Cummins Engine Compatibility
IMPORTANT INFORMATION BEFORE YOU BEGIN
Check your ECM
The Simulator has only been tested and shown to work on a handful of Cummins engines using Cummins CM2350 ECMs. Before you begin building your own Simulator we recommend that you ascertain what model ECM you have. As a general guideline the Simulator should work on all Cummins engines designated as EPA 13 and/or EPA 17. We believe that includes all engines produced since 2016. (Note: edited to change “2013” to “2016”.)
Even if your ECM is not a CM2350 but your engine was built by Cummins for on-road use in 2016 or later and it has the same 4-pin connector, there is a good chance that it will work, but this is YOUR DIY project so experiment at your own discretion.
We would recommend that if you do decide to continue, that you check your Simulator wiring very carefully for shorts, opens and proper connections. If everything checks out and you did not get any errors when you installed the Arduino firmware, then just put the Simulator away and forget it until and unless you have a real DEF sensor failure. Only then should you consider connecting the Simulator to the vehicle because at that point you have nothing to lose.
Check your wiring
Also before you start building anything we recommend you locate the connector between the OEM sensor on the DEF tank and the vehicle wiring harness and compare it to the photos below to ensure your coach is using the same style connector (click on the photos to expand):
Is this something I would need to do for my 2019 6.7 diesel with only 6000 miles on it with no issues yet.
My Dynamax fw30 4×4
I have the FORD ’20 6.7L “Scorpion” engine and there are numerous companies offering DEF and DPF delete tuning. That would be a work around until parts become available. Then the owner can have their stock tune reinstalled. Also, there’s the option for the Operator Commanded Regeneration feature to be turned on allowing owners to burn off the particle filter periodically. Local law enforcement suggested that I could straight pipe and DEF/DPF delete my truck for off the road use. The officer reminded me that KY has no emissions compliance annual vehicle inspections.
This is not a “delete” device in any way. It is just a temporary tool to allow an otherwise fully functional vehicle, including all emissions control systems, to continue safely until the failed OEM sensor can be replaced.
We do not encourage, condone or approve of any attempt to disable the emissions control systems and will not tolerate any discussion of such activities on this website.
Thank You for helping us stay on the road.
How do I find out the model # of my ECM?
Is the model number of ECM determined by my VIN# ?
Thanks in advance.
Tina, see the FAQ page 5th question down. https://defsim.myervin.com/faq
Is my 2016 2500HD Duramax affected by this?
This project is focused on only Cummins HD engines using CM2350 ECMs. We would not have any idea what your pickup might need.
Why not expand this solution to other Diesels? I have a 2500 RAM with the 6.7 L Cummins. The ECM is a IA80033. We tow a 30′ trailer, and are just as likely to be impacted by the sensor failure as any other diesel with a DEF system. I really applaud this effort, but why limit it?
Hi David. To be able to design a DSS-type device for a Ram pickup would require a great deal of detailed information about exactly how Fiat Chrysler and Cummins implemented the DEF monitoring system. Did they use J1939 or a proprietary design. If it is proprietary then game over. If they did use J1939 standard protocols than you need to figure out what is the Source Address, Manufacturer ID, Identity Number, Software ID, DM 19 Calibration Info and more. What is the network datarate? Where is the sensor located, what connector is used and how is it wired?
Do you have all that info just for starters?
All Diesel engines are affected by this if any part of the DEF system goes bad. My 2017 GMC 2500HD Denali 6.6 Duramax currently has a bad DEF Heater and they can’t get a new one due to the chip shortage so my truck is just sitting at the dealer.
This is a much larger issue than just RV’s, Semi trucks are also being affected and being parked due to DEF issues they can’t get parts for to get them back on the road.
The Manufacturer’s simply need the EPS to allow them to issue the software update to the Dealers so that all of these vehicles can have their ECM’s updated to not shut them down if something goes bad.
Todd, Yes you are correct that this is affecting all Diesel engines with DEF systems. However this project is focused on Large Cummins engines using the CM2350 ECM. The med duty trucks such as yours have a different programing connection as well as different programing. I do know that the larger engines that are used in heavy first responders do have a software update that keeps them from a derate status due to emissions. However, live literally depend on those. The EPA and several engine manufacture are currently working on a software solution, I do not know if that includes med duty vehicles.
is this only good for Cummins engines as I have a F250 diesel that I had trouble with & finely had them replaced but it could happen again while we re pulling our 5th wheel
Sorry this won’t work for your vehicle. It has not been tested on the med duty engines and probably wont even hook up to them in this configuration. The connector and ECM programming may be OBD instead of J1939 and the DEF system is very likely to be different.
I have a 2011 Fleetwood Discovery 42A with a Cummins 8.3 ISC in a Spartan chassis. It has the CM2250 ECM in it. Do you know if anyone has had luck with this working with that ECM? Thank you.
Curtis, we have not tested against the CM2250 as of yet, so I can not say definitively that it will work for you. I believe your 2011 was either the first or second year of def engines, the sensor pack used at that time was in the early stages and only measured quantity and temperature of the def. Some of those sensors were analog as well. This solution was engineered primarily for 2016 and above ECM that use digital monitoring.
We have a 2016 Tiffin Bus 450. We are currently stuck on the road with zero power to engine. Amarillo, Tx. There is a Cummins dealer in town do you think they can help with this problem? We had all lights on our dash board lite up.
Rebecca, The Cummins dealer in Amarillo is very knowledgeable. I’m sure they will be able to help diagnose your issues.
Question I already have a Raspberry Pi with CAN bus interface. Will the software load onto it and work?
No, the software and installer is Arduino based.
I have a 2020 Newmar Dutch Star w/ ISL9 450 engine. It has the CM2350 controller. L9 CM2350 L116B. Freightliner chassis. But the plug is different on the DEF head.
I have a picture but can’t post it.
Send it to “firstname.lastname@example.org”
I also have a different type of plug. Can you help if I send a picture?
We can try. If there are any numbers on the connector see if you can capture them. Also make, model, year of equipment, engine manufacturer and ecm version if known. Brand of def tank assembly would be good to know as well.
Mercedes is currently making changes to the emissions system. Is this related to the same issue?
I am not an expert but what I have read is that the Mercedes issue has to do with their software being programmed to recognize when it was undergoing an emissions test and changing certain parameters to lower emissions during the test. That is just what I understand from reading about it. There may be more but it is definitely not a problem the DSS would have anything to do with.
Hello, I have a 21 London Aire. CM 2450 per cummings website. I have also confirmed it has a gen 7 DEF head. Has anyone built and tested with this CM. So if you believe the the tooth fairy I may not have a problem, but would like to have as a back up. Thank you. Also posted on IRV2.
I don’t think anyone has tested the DSS on a CM2450 ECM. You could be the first. The worst it would probably do if it doesn’t work is throw the 3 usual codes which would clear themselves after reconnecting the OEM sensor and the internal diagnostics have run. If you try it let everybody know what you find.
I have a 2020 Tiffin RED 33AA with Cummins ISB 6.7 engine. I am not sure if it has a CM2350 ECM and is compatible with the DEF simulator. Could someone help me confirm this? I have already bought the parts. Hope it works. Thanks, Jerry
Hi Jerry. Yes the DSS should work just fine on your Tiffin RED. The only variable that you should double check is that the connector between the OEM sensor and the Cummins wiring harness is the rectangular 4-pin Deutsch DT04 connector as shown in the build instructions (I’m pretty sure that it is).
Archer2 – Thanks for you quick reply. I will take another look at the connector tomorrow. Jerry
Never mind. I tried again to get into Cummins Quickserve and finally got in. It says that my ISB 6.7 engine has the CM2350 ECM. Guess I better get building my DEF Head simulator. Regards, Jerry
I have a 2017 Tiffin Allegro Breeze 32BR. I am not sure about the ECM model. Any comments on the DSS compatibility?
I have a 2017 31BR Breeze. The ECM is shown in the Cumins manual as a 3230A. Will the DSS work with this ECM?
I just messaged another user who has the same Cummins ISV V-8 diesel with the CM3230A ECM. He told me that he had not quite finished his assembly and had not yet tried it on his coach but he did confirm that the connector is the Deutsch DT04 as called for in the original instructions on this site.
So, we don’t know for certain that the CanBed-based DSS will work on your coach, there is a very good chance that it will. My advice would be to build it and give it a test. I don’t think there is any risk of damage to your coach other than potentially having some kind of fault code. In that event just re-connecting the (working) OEM sensor will clear any codes. Good luck.
Thanks. I’ll build one as well, and report back. (I confirmed the DT-4 connector this morning).
Rich, I also have the 2017 31BR with the CM3230.
Did your build work? If so I’ll start to build one asap.
Have you heard back from anyone with the CM3230 for the Isv5.0 Cummins thats in the 2017 Breeze? I’d sure like to build a DSS since I’ve had two DEF issues with this MH.
I am still waiting for confirmation from another user with an ISV5.0. In the meanwhile although I don’t have that particular ECM or engine I do believe that the DSS will work fine. Even If I can’t get 100% confirmation for you if it were me I would build one up anyway for use if you do have a failure of the DEF sensor. You really have nothing to lose. I can’t imagine that connecting the DSS up would cause any problem and I don’t think it could possibly cause any harm other than just not working.
I have a 2017 Monaco Diplomat with the Cummins ISL9 450. The ECM is EB90154. Is this compatible with the DEF simulator.
That looks more like the ECM Serial number not the model number but the info you really want is yes, you should have a CM2350 and it will work. But as always, check the connector on your particular Motorhome and verify for yourself through testing or some other way that you know which connector yours has and which wires go where. I don’t know what chassis a Monaco has, Freightliner?
I have a 2011 Allegro bus. We are dead in the water in Jonestown PA. Neither Cummins or Tiffin have given me any optimism about getting on the road again (1700 miles away from Houston.
Reading through the posts it seems we are still at ground zero.
We are 35 miles from Cummins and a dreaded tow would be $$$$$$.
Can you provide some clue as to why you are broken down? Fault codes, SPNs, symptoms? Frankly,given the year your coach is, it’s not likely to be a candidate for the DSS. The troublesome DEF sensors started around 2016
I have 2016 Allegro Bus with a chassis built in 2015 (ISL 450 CM2350). I see 3 wires going into my DEF connector. Will this work on my coach? I do not have the DEF quality sensor on mine.
Probably not. But even better, your model is much less likely to fail from what we’ve seen.
Good morning-Per the Cummins QuickServe website our 5.0LV8 ESN data states this engine uses ECM VERSION: CM3230A
This engine is in a 2017 Tiffin Breeze 31BR motorhome.
Is this ECM compatible with your design? Kindly Advise. Thank you.
I’m afraid I don’t have any idea. Maybe if you sent a picture of the DEF tank and the sensor along with its connector I might be able to guess. Email to email@example.com
I should have the final connector parts to finish the DSS for my Freightliner M2 106 2019 Renegade Verona LE 40LTS. I saw this in the article above “ Only then should you consider connecting the Simulator to the vehicle because at that point you have nothing to lose.”
It seems to me it would be best to connect the finished DSS and then road test the vehicle to verify its functionality? Then if it road tests fine, unhook the DSS, reconnect the “not yet failed” DEF Header, and then store your verified fully functional DSS away for use when and if you get the dreaded failure. Is there some reason NOT to road test the completed DSS before storing it for future use?
Thanks for the great work.
Honestly Douglas, no, there really is nothing wrong with testing the device on your vehicle if you like. I would still urge you to first double check everything that you can on the bench using a meter to catch any errors that may be there. About the only thing that can go wrong outside of the things you can physically see and assuming that the firmware downloaded from your pc onto the board with no errors is the remote but still possible chance that the board itself is bad. I just got a new variant of board for testing from China and it had a bad USB port right out of the box, so it does happen
Anyway, if you want to hook it up and give it a spin, please do. The worst that can happen is you get some faults and there are instructions on the site and in the comments on how to clear any fault codes up no problem.
Thanks… Of course we plan on a thorough test and double check of the DSS components, etc, but will probably do a field test also for piece of mind. Hopefully next weekend or shortly there after.
So glad that us in the equipment world are not the only ones with this problem. Thank you for all the time you guys spent in putting this together. I have 7 Skytrak brand forklifts with bad DEF heads and they are down.(5mph derate) (That’s 20% of my fleet !) These machines use a very similar DEF head and connector and use the CM2350 control unit although the are 4cylidner QSF engines. That should not matter right? Am I correct in thinking you are basically telling the CM2350 that the level, Temp, and Quality of def are correct so that it can complete the regen process as it normally would ? Very interested in trying this on some of these machines and getting them back up and running again and would like you opinion. Again thank you for all the time and energy that has been spent on this . Glad I am not the only one who hates to be held hostage by clay, copper, and solder !!!!
Hi James, check your email for my thoughts. One thing I do need to stress is that the DSS just allows an otherwise fully functional vehicle that has a failed DEF sensor to be operated safely and normally until permanent repairs can be made. But EVEN WITH THE DSS IN PLACE you must still maintain a supply of quality DEF fluid and your emissions systems including the SCR (DEF) system. The DSS IS NOT A DELETE DEVICE IN ANY WAY. If you run out of DEF fluid the emissions controls will immediately go into a fault state and deration will be imposed. Actual damage to other components such as the DEF doser unit, pump and injector valve is a very real possibility.
I have the same problem with a Gehl RS 10-55 telehandler. I was just wondering if you had any success with the DEF Sensor Simulator on you Skytrak.
Hi Dan, I’m not James but if you have. Cummins engine with a CM2350 ECM then odd are very good that the DSS will work on your machine. The other thing to check is whether the OEM DEF sensor uses the Deutsch DT-04 connector or is something different. If it’s not the DT-04 or the TE HDSCS (Freightliner-type) then you will have to figure out the connector.
I got a little ahead of myself confirming that our 2015 Allegro Bus has the CM2350 as required. In fact our ECM is listed on Cummins QuickServe On-Line as VIN 73741494 ISL9 CM2350 L101. What I failed to confirm was the number of wires on the connector. Ours has only three, Red, Black and Yellow, no blue. Will the simulator support our configuration?
Sorry but no. Yours is one of the engines built during the “cross over” from analog or hybrid analog/digital to all digital. So the DSS cannot be made to work with your sensor. But, as we’ve pointed out before, your sensor is very unlikely to fail in the same way as the newer, digital units.
Thank for the update. I should be able to sell the components as a kit or separately
I have a question about the wiring. I have a 2015 Tiffin Allegro Bus with a 450hp Cummins with a Power Glide Chassis. I noticed that I don’t have the 4 wire square connector and was wondering if this was still going to work. What I have is a 3 wire, tried to attach a picture but had no luck.
I ordered the Digikey 1597-102991321 ND circuit board.
Hi Dennis. Your vehicle was built early enough so that it has an analog sensor for the DEF system and the DSS is only for simulating all-digital systems. The DSS will not work. It’s not a matter of the connector but is, instead, a fundamental design incompatibility.
The good news is that your sensor is not among those that are having the abnormal failure rates.
So if you can still cancel your orders you should so you don’t waste your money.
Hello Archer. Like David Carter above, I also have the ISL9 CM2350 L101 model, build date 08/21/2015. I was unable to get the plug (head and plug looks totally different from the plug you’re showing) apart (didn’t want to force it) but based on the service model name and build date, would this also be an engine built before or during or before the “crossover’? Have over 18,000 miles on it with no issues so far. Thanks very much.
I would guess that you do have one of the earlier sensors. If the DEF tank sensor connector has only 3 (or 2) wires then it is definitely not a digital sensor and thus as far as I know it isn’t compatible with the DSS operation.
Thanks very much. You guys have done a great service for the rest of us.
I have a 2020 Tiffin Phaeton engine number 74618593 and ECM number HB80525 Cummins engine. It does have the 4 pin connector. Is the box compatible?
I assume that when you say it has a “4-pin connector”, you mean it has a Deutsch DT04 connector as shown in the Quick Build instructions or it has the “Freightliner-style” TE Connectivity HDSCS black and yellow connector? As long as you wire whichever you have carefully according to the respective instructions you should be fine.
I have the 2017 31BR with the Cummins 5.0 and CM 3230. I saw in earlier posts of others with this same engine building the DSS. Did they have any luck?
I have had two def issues and luckily got stranded in a safe place where I was able to replace the head. I currently am too nervous to take any distant trips so I’d like to build the DSS hoping that it will help should I get stranded again – I might not be so lucky to get stuck in a safe place when it fails again.
You guys are the best! You’d think that the makers of these units would be a bit more proactive.
I’m glad that I found this thread, but not sure if my situation fits the criteria.
2013 Ford F-750 with 240hp Cummins 6.7(Used in a rollback truck). As of today, the closest def sensor from any dealer I have spoken with is 2.5 months….and that’s if all promises are kept.
Would this application work on this truck? Thanks.
Sorry but I don’t know enough about how your truck’s DEF sensors work to say with 100% certainty but I doubt that this would work at all on your equipment.
Sorry but good luck on the replacement. I will say that I am shocked that your dealer is saying that there is a long wait for the sensor. Yours is not the same as the ones that have been failing. The problematic ones are combined temperature, level and quality all-in-one sensors and are digital J1939 CANBUS devices.
Good luck anyway.
Thank you for the quick reply. It is a combination sensor, but originally I heard that this was a 2016- issue. We spoke with Cummins and Ford, and they stated that this was not linked to the major shortage, but low and behold, neither has been able to find one with a lead time of less than 3 months. I was really hoping of coming up with an emission happy solution.
Anyone have any luck on Paccar Engines?
I have a b6.7 360 (2021) Cummins with a CM2450 ECM. I noted above one person was going to try the simulator on this ECM. Did that ever happen and if so did it work?
I don’t think that they ever posted what the result was but I have every reason to believe that the DSS will work perfectly well on an ISB with a CM2450 ECM. IF I were you, I would not hesitate to build one and test it.
Thanks Archer2. I appreciate it.
Does anyone know of a file for construction equipment and paccar engines? I’m a heavy equipment mechanic and looking for a temporary solution for CAT and John Deere machines. Going to build a few of these. One for our cummins powered trucks, one for our paccar powered trucks, cat and deere. Any help on a download would be greatly appreciated.
Hi Andrew. The DSS was written to emulate the J1939 CANBUS messages of a properly functioning DEF sensor that satisfies a Cummins CM2350 ECMs diagnostics. It does also work with other ECMs but the only way to find out is to plug it in and test it. The only differences among the various versions described on this website are related to different requirements of the specific microcontroller versions and vehicle wiring connectors, not any differences in the Vehicle ECMs. All versions appear the same to the ECM.
If you can just verify the correct connections for CAN HIGH, CAN LOW, +DCV and Ground for the application and connect it, then just hook it up and see if it works. It’s very unlikely to do any damage other that causing a spurious fault code that will have to be cleared.
If you do find that it works on engine/ECM combinations other than Cummins please post back and let others know.